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OK we went to the Scion dealer and checked the tC out. Of course I LOVED it. My dad on the other hand was looking at the xB and inquiring about it. Thing is I can get the xB definitely since my dad has an eye out for it but I want the TC!!!! The things my dad hates about the tC are the gas milage 23 city 30 highway and that it's a 2 door!! I know I can't get around the 2 door problem but lets say I was to buy the tC, is there any way of installing something to improve the gas milage of the tC? Please help me, we're real close to buying the new honda civic coupe ex 2006 since it's got great gas milage.... but i want a tc !!!!!
 

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I, myself just bought 2006 5 spd (Azure Pearl).. it really depends on how and where you drive.. gas money in the long run won't be too much of a difference IMO.. well good luck with the car man, i was in the same situation week and 1/2 ago..
 

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If you are getting a car paid for take what you can get and be very grateful you have parents willing to do that for you. Beggers can't be choosers.
 

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Your dad is gonna be paying for the car, but who's gonna be paying for the gas?
 

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There is nothing you can do to the tC to make it get the same gas mileage as an xB.
 

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So get the automatic.. lol. Seriously, I don't think gas milage should be the deciding factor when purchasing a new car (unless it's a gas guzzler which this is not).

Sit down and have a good talk with your dad. Let him know you really want the tC, and if he really is still concerned about gas, let him know that you got it covered no matter who is driving it. I mean this is your car right? Get what you'll be happy with.
 

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Originally posted by Plissken@Sep 15 2005, 07:59 PM
If you are getting a car paid for take what you can get and be very grateful you have parents willing to do that for you. Beggers can't be choosers.
exactally what I was thinking.

nod. smile. and love the car that was given to you.


I am sure there is a thread about that here, somewhere.




anyway, there really is nothing wrong with an xB. i would rock one.
 

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I happen to be a 52 year-old "dad" who bought a tC for my daughter a little over a year ago.

My credentials - more for your dad's reference: I am an engineer (registered professional mechanical engineer in 2 states); very particular; perform detailed analysis of every major purchse, especailly vehicles; and have been a faithful reader of Consumer Reports for 30 years (the most objective publication out there) - especially the automotive reviews and reliability records. I also have driven literally dozens of different cars from itty-bitty sub-compacts to mild performance vehicles to monster trucks (personal rides and 100's of business rentals over 30 years). However, I have actually owned very few vehicles, because I have selected them for excellent reliability and kept none for less than 9 years. My current main vehicle is a 1996 Toyota 4-Runner with 215,000+ miles, and it runs like the day I bought it. (and I use it to tow a 4,200# boat & trailer...)

I looked for a full year in preparation of buying my daughter a car when she started her senior year in high school. (She had been an exemplary student and athlete, and deserved a reward.) I had narrowed the field down to the usual suspects by the end of her junior year (Honda Civic; Toyota Corolla, Matrix or CRX; Subaru...). I test drove about 6 different vehicles, and I had really come to prefer the then-new Mazda 3i to the rest of the pack (Consumer Reports later listed it as it's highest-rated small car, the tC not yet being on the streets). But my daughter didn't really like the way it looked, or the way the seat cloth felt. Just then we started seeing some subtle ads and reports on the soon-to-be released tC. I did all the usual research, read the articles, saw one at a dealer, and we went and drove the automatic at some of the marketing events on July 3, 2004. Being impressed, I hounded the dealer until he could get a manual on his lot to test drive. We all drove the manual, and loved it. We made the order right then and there, and received the car a few weeks later.

After a year, here's the bottom line:
1) For the $$$, the base car is the absolute best value on the market (you can buy some nice, stripped down cars for less) - you get a sleek, safe, quiet, smooth, sophisticated, unique, well-handling vehicle that has a wonderful balance betwen performance and comfort, and some practicality; although you won't put any tall people in the back seat or their heads will hit. It is not a race-car, or even a "fast" car, per se, despite all the hoopla on the various forums; but it is plenty quick, is easy to merge into traffic, and really fun to drive. (I imagine with the elusive supercharger one could get into some speed, however.)
2)The main components of the car (Avensis chassis and Camry drivetrain) are proven Toyota products. Any problems with the new-design body have really been minor or extremely rare, and a reputable dealer will correct them. The front suspension has extra reinforcement for rigidity, and the doors have extra reinforcement for both rigidity and safety.
3) Between the maneuverability, 4-wheel discs/ABS, and the airbags, I consider it to be as safe as or safer than most cars on the road. With the optional side airbags, there's very few better. You can check out the government rating yourself at the NHTSA web site.
4) The manual gets better gas mileage on the highway than rated - we got near 33 in the winter (no A/C), and just over 31 in the summer (A/C on), at a steady 70 mph. We've gotten the rated mileage around town.
5) The only problem we had was the "drifting" A/C vents on the dash, and the dealer replaced those with some that were not quite as smooth so they remained where you placed them. (Some of the tC's vents would drift to the side if you didn't have them dead-center in the detent... they operated so smoothly that minute vibrations would cause them to drift "downhill" to whichever direction they were pointed.)
6) I would buy this car again in a heart beat - I have seen nothing out there that would be better for a sporty, small coupe/hatchback. (But I would not buy the xB because I just don't like the way it looks - other than that, it's a fine vehicle if you want/need a roomy econobox.)
7) The only thing I don't like about this car is the throttle-by-wire in conjunction with the manual transmission. I'm so accustomed to other conventional-throttle manuals, that I needed some time to get familiar with the subtle difference in clutch/throttle timing.

I hope that helps you. Good Luck!
 

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you can get replacement air vents!?!? those stupid things have been driving me crazy! do you just go to the dealer and ask?
 

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Consumer reports "objective?" The same guys who were recorded saying about the Suzuki Samurai - "If I can't find someone to roll that thing, I'll do it myself!" THat doesn't sound objective to me.

The only thing I trust them to get right is the owner's reports of reliability because it is entirely based on owner's inputs. It was the primary reason I chose to buy a Toyota in 1988, and have stuck with them ever since.

And you'd be amazed how much better the throttle response is with a light flywheel. It isn't the drive-by-wire at all, its too much rotating mass directly connected to the crank.
 

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1. I did not say throttle response was bad... I merely stated it was different than what I was used to. One could argue for days about the pros and cons of light and heavy flywheels; and that may even have something to do with my initial "difficulties" with clutch/throttle coordination. But those difficulties are a thing of the past. I don't have a problem with the throttle response.

2. Yes, if you want truly objective (absolutely no advertising), practical evaluations of any product, including vehicles, Consumer Reports is the best place to go. I work hard for my $$$ - I want them to also work hard for me. However, if your thing is performance enhancement, serious modifications, or racing, then it's obviously not the place to go. After some 30 years reading the magazine and using the data provided (yes - factual data, not rumor & innuendo), I haven't gone wrong yet. In over 70 years, the organization has only been sued a few times, and they have won every case - including the Suzuki Samurai case. (It was probably before your time, but when front-wheel drive was pretty new to the American scene, either Car & Driver or Road & Track picked the Dodge Omni/Plymouth Horizon as its [small?] car of the year. CU rated it unacceptable due to a suspension resonance that caused instability in avoidance-maneuver situations. In the next model year, Chrysler made significant changes to correct the problem, but never owned up to its existence.) Now, that doesn't mean I always buy their top-rated pick or even best-buy (although often that is the case); but I do use their test data to evaluate the products using my own criteria-weighting, which is sometimes different from theirs.

That said, I also recommend reading all the test data from all the sources you can get.... The more info you have, the better your choices are likely to be. Information>knowledge>power
 

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Originally posted by ohdamniskev@Sep 15 2005, 06:21 PM
but i want a tc !!!!!
I can only think of one thing bad about xb to tell your dad: wind noise is terrible when going high way speed because it's literaly a brick punching a suqare hole into the air.


But if I am buying the first car for my son, I would buy the xb for a million other reasons. It's slower, so the dang kid won't get into little races and then call me when he's in a ditch. It's his first car, better safe and slow then be fast and DEAD. It's more humble and more functional.

xb is not a bad car. It's slower, but fast enough. It has 4 doors so your friends will love you. It has a big back seat and you can easily get into it, so your girlfriend/boyfriend will love you for that
 
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