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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
its 12:40AM, and im driving home from a friends. i turn left onto the main road which is 3 lanes wide, and a early '90's celica revs on me as i pass him while he tries to pull on to the road from the oppisite side of the street. im not in the mood to race, im tired, and im worried about some personal issues. driving towards the 805 on this road i hit a red, and the celica pulls next to me. it turns green and he takes off, and i drive normal. when the celica is about 2 car lengths in front of me, he slows down and waits for me to pull along side of him.... then he takes off... and repeats this process trying to get me to launch with him. so about the 4th time he does this to me, i say "screw it," look over to him, and as soon as we make eye contact, he takes off. i down shift into 3rd from 5th. (i was going about 50, and i dont have the gear/speed ratios memorized.... wasn't sure if 2nd was safe). he didn't stand a chance. i redlined 3rd, and he was about 2 carlengths behind me. i give 4th gear about 2 seconds, still pulling on him, and decide to end it.

we hit another red light, and he revs up his car like the first spanking wasn't enough. it turns green, and i get a pretty good launch (considering i have the stock rubber on) and pull ahead of him easily. so easily, in fact, that i dont think he's trying, and let off the gas. but no, i hear his soda can muffler loud and clear at full throttle and see that hes catching up quick. downshifting from 3rd to 2nd i pull away again and hit the brakes when i have about 5 carlengths on him. slowing down to the 50 mph speed limit, the celica does a fly by, and takes the first turn off the main road that he can.

the end.
 

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haha bro nice kill...them ol skool celicas are crap if theyre not turbocharged and also if theyre not the all tracs...My cousin has a 91 al trac and takes me everytime we race...He always kills me by atleast 1 car...tC -160hp, 163tq vs Celica 91 all-trac 200 hp=celica all-trac eatin on some rice
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
yeah, im not sure what trim level it was because he didn't have any badges on his car... if it was an all trac he should have beat me, either that or he doesnt know how to drive....
 

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Hamster, not to flame, but based on this your shifting descriptions in this post and some comments from another it seems like u really are all over the place bro. U were thinking about downshifting into 2nd going 50?!!! Thats funny, u would have blown your tranny to hell. And why did u downshift from 3rd to 2nd while moving at speed, unless your rpms were below 2,000, u could have just floored it and had better acceleration without having to shift twice (once into second, then back into 3rd) I dont know man, just the way it sounds to me, no offense though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Originally posted by $The TC$ @HTown@Jul 26 2005, 09:30 PM
Hamster, not to flame, but based on this your shifting descriptions in this post and some comments from another it seems like u really are all over the place bro. U were thinking about downshifting into 2nd going 50?!!! Thats funny, u would have blown your tranny to hell. And why did u downshift from 3rd to 2nd while moving at speed, unless your rpms were below 2,000, u could have just floored it and had better acceleration without having to shift twice (once into second, then back into 3rd) I dont know man, just the way it sounds to me, no offense though.
educate yourself with this:

taken from zoltz's webpage

i could have downshifted to 2nd while going 50... but i would have needed to shift right away into third if i did that.... so i did choose the right gear.

the run from a dead stop i took off so good compared to him that i thought he didnt' want to race.... i ended up in 3rd... and saw that he was trying, and put it back into 2nd.

and if you think that as long as you are over 2000 rpm and you dont need to down shift... then you are mistakenly wrong. if we had a race from a roll, starting at 20mph... and i started in 1st and you in 2nd.... i would kick your ass
 

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Kid--your a dork, and u have no idea what u are talking about. The max allowed speed for 2nd gear is 50, and for 3rd its 77. WHY IN THE HECK WOULD YOU SHIFT INTO 2ND GOING 50, YOU'D BE TOPPING OUT AS SOON AS U GOT IN GEAR. OF COURSE U SHOULD HAVE CHOSEN 3RD, U DONT HAVE TO BE A GENIUS TO KNOW THAT, WHICH U OBVIOUSLY ARE SINCE U WENT ONLINE AND GOT GEAR RATIO SPECS TO TRY AND ACT SMART. I SEEN YOUR WEBSITE, TRY A LITTLE HARDER BUDDY.
PS. while your redlining in 3rd, i'm shifting into 4th, catching the gear a 4k RPMS and blowing by you while your sloppliy shifting into 4th. Racing is not about redlining every gear, in fact, u are killing your motor if u are doing that. But who cares, mommy and daddy will just buy u a new car, right?
 

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somebody please tell me, why would u shift into a gear if u had to shift right out of it, thats that stupidest waste of time I've ever heard of. and ur talking about racing. I just blew by u son. Have fun when u blow ur motor!
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Originally posted by $The TC$ @HTown@Jul 28 2005, 09:38 PM
Kid--your a dork, and u have no idea what u are talking about. The max allowed speed for 2nd gear is 50, and for 3rd its 77. WHY IN THE HECK WOULD YOU SHIFT INTO 2ND GOING 50, YOU'D BE TOPPING OUT AS SOON AS U GOT IN GEAR. OF COURSE U SHOULD HAVE CHOSEN 3RD, U DONT HAVE TO BE A GENIUS TO KNOW THAT, WHICH U OBVIOUSLY ARE SINCE U WENT ONLINE AND GOT GEAR RATIO SPECS TO TRY AND ACT SMART. I SEEN YOUR WEBSITE, TRY A LITTLE HARDER BUDDY.
PS. while your redlining in 3rd, i'm shifting into 4th, catching the gear a 4k RPMS and blowing by you while your sloppliy shifting into 4th. Racing is not about redlining every gear, in fact, u are killing your motor if u are doing that. But who cares, mommy and daddy will just buy u a new car, right?
if racing isn't about redlining every gear, why does every one do it? when they show the drivers view on a race, and they show the gas/brake, tach, speedometer, etc, i always see them redline the gear.

an no, mommy and daddy arn't going to buy me a new car as i am paying for this myself.... they're helping me out to pay it off quicker so i wont get killed with interest, but in the end this will be my car.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Originally posted by $The TC$ @HTown@Jul 28 2005, 09:46 PM
somebody please tell me, why would u shift into a gear if u had to shift right out of it, thats that stupidest waste of time I've ever heard of. and ur talking about racing. I just blew by u son. Have fun when u blow ur motor!
if you read what i already said... i agree with you.... i did shift into third...and pulled on him hard... if i shifted into 2nd i would have needed to shift into third right away.... im not afraid to redline my car.... think what you like about redlining... i know its safe

your getting on my case for something i didn't do... but thought about.

if the max speed for 2nd gear was 60.... then i would have regretted downshifting into 3rd... it actually is 52 and im glad i didn't do it.
 

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$The TC$ @HTown, so name calling makes you the better driver? We don't much appreciate personal attacks on this board. Yelling doesn't make you right either.

I've read your argument. It doesn't hold much water. Maybe you should consider the powerband before you make judgments about how to shift. Let's take a look at the dyno chart and figure out where we should shift, eh?



Horsepower continuously increases in this BASELINE dyno for a tC all the way to 5700 rpm, but shifting at peak power is dumb. At 6000 rpm, we've still got 130 hp on tap. So the idea is to use the chart hamster provided to figure out where the best shift point really is.

1 - 2 shift - This shift sucks rocks period. Even shifting at 6000 rpm, you drop down to just under 3500 rpm. You drop from 130 hp all the way down to the high 90's. There is no way to "fix" this, it just is. Shifting at redline (6250 rpm) will drop to exactly 3500 rpm. It is obvious there is no advantage to shifting this shift before redline as your hp will be even less, and your ability to cover ground will suffer. Remember, it's area under the curve that wins.

2 - 3 shift - This shift isn't a lot better, but at least you don't drop so badly. If you shift at 6050 rpm, you drop to 3950. That's at least somewhere in the powerband above 100 hp, but it's still only about 112 hp.

3 -4 shift - The ratios are a little more helpful as we start hitting the aerodynamic wall hard. Shifting at 6200 rpm from third to fourth puts us at 4550 rpm after the shift, or pretty damn close to the same hp after the shift as before the shift, with the curve working for us. Much better than either of the two previous shifts.

4 - 5 shift - Now were finally at a shift where we need to do some real thinking. Here, it finally makes sense to shift at 6000 rpm because we end up at 4750. Almost exactly the same hp after the shift as we had before the shift. This is the ideal shift point.

The whole reason this works is because you need to maximize the area under the curve. There is more area to be had by shifting at a higher point because you don't drop down into the no power zone after the shift. And please, take the torque arguments and stuff it. Getting to the other end of the track is all about doing work, not feeling torque in your butt. Shifting at these points may not give you the feeling in your backside that you want, but it will for sure get you down the track quicker.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
thanks lance, for explaining to him, and teaching me
 

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Oh, yeah, I should probably mention, the reason you see the racecar guys hitting redline on their shifts is because their gearboxes and engines are set up to work that way. It's NOT a given that redline shifting makes sense. You have to "do your homework" to figure out where best to shift in each gear, or have enough money to have a selection of gear ratios to choose the best combination for the venue.

And all this BS about blowing up your engine is just plain stupid. Toyota builds some of the most over-engineered engines in the automotive world. You could run all day long at redline if you wanted to. It won't be great for ring life, but it isn't going to blow up on you. These are the same kind of guys who build motorcycle engines that redline at 14k and never miss a beat. Take your Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt and try to scare someone else, you just don't know what you're talking about.
 

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and lance steps out with the hard caliber's again. $thetc$htoerjtb (or whatever) - where you at now?
 

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Lance definitely rocks my socks!
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
he makes the saying "knowledge is power" valid.
 

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$The TC$ @HTown, you get
 
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